How To Deal With Reverse Culture Shock (Moving Back To India After Masters In The USA POV) - w/ Ratik

the job market in the US is pretty horrible. Most of my classmates are also struggling and more in the same mode. Having that sense of community helped me get through that difficult time before I finally made the decision that it is in time for me to move on. I'm sure you must have touched with what's commented effort to as a reverse culture show, which do you think was more valuable for you, your MBA or the masters that you got out of you. And then there are a few people who are making fun of me for that. What is the logic to the side of the house look like when you are leaving the country for good.

I am British about the Indian market. I think that good things are set to come in the future in the next few years. What can you tell us about perception of somebody that comes by after getting that degree from the US? Do you feel like an outsider in India now that you've come back? That's actually a very interesting question. Welcome to the Ready Set Do podcast where we learn from journeys of not experts who are just two steps ahead of us. I'm Naman Pandey and in this episode featured not expert is Ratic Datta.

Ratic is a marketing ops assistant manager at Seed Global Education, which is a role he started after finishing his masters in marketing from Purdue University and then moving back to India thereafter. Ratic takes us through the realities of a move back to India after completing one's higher education from the US. We cover grappling with the reverse culture shock, prospects of getting jobs and perception of foreign grabs and somewhat paradoxically settling back into one's own home. This is a topic that myself and every other international student has definitely wondered about at one point or the other. And so we leave no stone unturned in covering all the logistical as well as mental preparations that must go into this decision.

We also contrast getting an MBA in India versus getting masters in the US and what Ratic makes of the India growth story. In keeping with the theme of learning from somebody that's just two steps ahead of us instead of an expert. My goal with this episode is to unearth all the nuances that you can really only know once you've already made the move. This is the Ready Set Do podcast and to support it, please subscribe to the YouTube channel and or leave me up to a five star eating on Spotify or any other podcast app of your choice. You can also check out the other links in description to support me, including buying me a coffee. And now without any further ado, my friends, here's Ratic. Ratic welcome. Hi, Naman. How are you doing? Doing very well. It's so good to

finally sit down and chat with you here. How's your move back been so far? It's been an interesting experience. Actually, it's been about a month and a half since I came back here. A lot of feelings, very bittersweet, very glad to be here back with family and friends, but do miss the US quite a bit. So it's always amazing talking to a fellow Boiler maker. So I'm glad to be doing this. Thank you for having me. Absolutely. And yeah, really excited to jump into, you know, all of the various things that we just mentioned and many more things here. So, you know, just to set the stage, can you talk about a little bit your experience like what had brought you to the US? I know you had a masters in marketing, but other than that, do you mind, you know, just giving us a brief snapshot

of maybe what led you to the US and what your experience was like with academia in the US? Sure. Absolutely. Coming to the US was always like a childhood dream of mine ever since I was a little boy. I had always dreamt of coming to the US partly because majorly because most of my mom's side of the family, my maternal grandparents and my aunt and my uncle lived here and lived there in the US. So I'd always kind of visualize myself going to school to the US someday and getting the opportunity to meet them more often and more frequently as well. Then there were a few things that happened during my undergrad and I kind of gave me the impression that I wanted to stay back in India for a bit. So I gave up on the US dream for a bit. I ended up doing an MBA from

Athena School of Management, which is based in Mumbai again, my hometown and I got the opportunity to work with a lot of people from all across the world because the business school is a very global business school and that once again set the stage for me to want to go to the US and what actually exacerbated the situation was the fact that I ended up going to the US in 2022 for a holiday to meet my mom's side of the family and that completely became my interest of wanting to go to the US.

I landed in New York City and one of the first places I went to was Times Square and I was just in awe when I saw how amazing the city is and how amazing that iconic location is and my heart was pretty much set. I knew that this is what I wanted to do one day. So I started the process of applying to universities in the US. I applied to quite a few universities and by God's grace I had the good fortune of getting into most of them and for the university is the university that I ended up going and I think it was the best decision of my life in all honesty. The experience was pretty, it's been an indelible experience. I got to meet people from all over the world.

Most of my class was comprised of Indian students but because Purdue is such a, there's so many things going on, so many extracurricular activities to do, so many extracurricular activities that you can be a part of. I ended up meeting people from both other programs and from undergrad as well which ended up enriching my experience even more. So I think it's been quite an unforgettable experience in all honesty and an experience I would definitely encourage people to try these ones in their life. But we're moving away from home, going to a new country. It really teaches you a lot of things about yourself and about life in general which I think is very important for your development. Absolutely. And I know that you touched on this on your recent video on your channel where

you talked about an in-depth explanation. Well, maybe explanation isn't the best word but from your perspective and in-depth guide around, maybe guide isn't the best word either, but about how to move back and why you move back and what the circumstances were around you moving back. So yeah, I know you referenced this there as well and it really stood out to me because that is something that I wholeheartedly agree with also. That irrespective of, you know, what your goals are, what you're trying to do. It is an experience that is in my mind at least and sounds like you agree. A net good for somebody like it's you become the person that comes out the other end is just objectively a better person, a more balanced, more independent, just more able person in my opinion.

So yeah, I do agree with what you're saying there. Next, I kind of want to shift our attention to the you know, tail end of your time at Purdue. So can you talk us through, say maybe when you were three months out of, you know, your graduation date, you were probably in the market looking for jobs. I'm assuming that I have no way of doing that. But can you walk us through, you know, those last final months and what was going on with your, you know, career, your mental health and all of all of the above. You're sure I think my, I so I graduated in the month of me, my, my graduation ceremony was on the 12th of May, 2024. And till then I was pretty, there were a lot of things going on in my mind. Even before I graduated, I had considered moving back to India. Even before I, right after my graduation as well, but talking to my,

my best friend and my uncle made me realize that staying back in the U.S. would actually prove to be a, it would be, it would prove to be the icing on the cake for my overall U.S. experience. And I kind of agreed, I thought that getting that work experience in the U.S. is kind of integral to complete the U.S. journey. So I decided to stay back. I decided in the month of April, I think that I'm going to stay back. And I'll give looking, looking for a job a shot.

So my, the reason why I wanted to go back was simply because I, as much as I love the U.S., I was really missing home a lot. And I kind of wasn't the impression that I might be, I might be happier back home. And maybe I would consider coming back to the U.S. at some point ahead in the future. But I was pretty keen back, when I, after speaking to my uncle, I was pretty keen on the idea that I wanted to work in the U.S. So I rigorously started my job. So it's in the month of May. I was, I left the U.S. on the 13th of August. So I, I spent about three months looking for a job. It was a very, it was a testing time for sure. I, I'm not going to shoot it because I know that a lot of people would be relying on your video to understand the mindset that I was in. But I've always kind of looked at life very positively,

tried to be as optimistic as, as I possibly can about life. Look at the glass is half full, rather than half empty or completely full of water and air, depending on how you want to look at it. Yeah. So I just thought that I didn't really think too much about the result. I was thinking more about my duty, when my duty at that time was to apply to as many jobs as I could, network with as many individuals as I could. I did have a timeline for myself. I did think that, okay, if I don't get a job by August, I will be looking to go back and I'll be more than happy to walk through exactly why I chose to do that as well. But those three months were, I mean, they were trying times because, and the thing is, I think what helped me was the fact that I was not alone in this journey. The job market in the U.S. is pretty, it's pretty horrible at the,

at this point of time. And so most of my other classmates were also struggling and were in the same boat as me. So having that sense of community kind of helped me get through that difficult time before I finally made the decision that it doesn't need time for me to go back and I ended up coming back here to India. I landed on the 15th of August, which is the Indian and Independence Day. I kind of tried to make it work taken away. I appreciate that. You know, that all makes sense and most of the tracks. A couple of the callouts from what you just laid out, you use the word duty, which I think is interesting in the sense that you don't normally associate that with, you know, when times are hard and when you're trying to apply to jobs and nothing's going your way, where does that come

from? Is that like a Bhagavad Gita reference or where does that come from? Yeah, exactly. You hit the nail right on the head. It is actually a Bhagavad Gita reference. So my, Marci, my aunt, she, this is her favorite port from the Bhagavad Gita, her favorite learning from the Bhagavad Gita where you specifically talk about when Lord Krishna tells Arjuna to focus on the duty and not the end result. As someone who is looking for a job, as someone who had just graduated from Purdue, my duty at that point of time was to apply to as many jobs as I can. And not just in terms of, not just in terms of quantity, but also applying for quality jobs as well. When I say quality, I mean, making sure that I'm networking with the right people, getting references and

then applying. So that's where I kind of derived it from. It's from my, Marci that I got this learning from. And I think it really helps you calm your nerves quite a bit. I've kind of used that in different other, different aspects of my life as well. Instead of focusing on the result, if you just focus on the journey and not the destination, the journey becomes all the more beautiful. And I think the destination is all the more rewarding in that way in that sense as well.

Yeah, I completely agree. And as you can probably tell, it is something that's really close to me as well. I find myself relying on that most days actually. And as you said, it's just so applicable for me. It just serves as my not star. And just, you know, hopefully this isn't too much of a tangent, but I have other things to get to. But before I do that, it's, I was reading it. I guess what I'm trying to get at is it's so funny how this wisdom that is obviously so old. It's, you know, centuries old is almost in a lot of ways recycled and pushed back in just in the under the garb of signs. So if you've ever read atomic habits or any of these, you know, productivity books, they all talk about process over goals. And really, if you think about it, process over goals is

literally just duty over, you know, fruits of your labor. So that was a realization that, you know, it hit me and I found it prudent to share here. But nevertheless, you also referenced some of your friends that were applying that, you know, were in the market with you in the job market, that is, are you willing to speak to where they are currently obviously broad strokes, have most of them found a job or are they still looking or what's it looking like for your peers that are still in the US as of now? Sure, absolutely. Before I get to that, this is a small note that I wanted to add to people who might be in a similar boat as me.

So I would highly recommend, I had my personal reasons for wanting to come back to India for a period of three months. But personally, if you ask me, I think that unless you have some considerations or constraints, which kind of make it necessary for you to move back to your home country, I would suggest staying back in the US for as long as you can. Because I do really value my experience in the US a lot, but I do feel that having that work experience under your belt before you go back to your home country is very beneficial. Not just in terms of your overall growth and development, but it also helps a lot when you're looking for jobs back in your home country as well. I didn't mean to go off a tangent, I just thought that was- No, you're good.

I'm going to go off a new tangent on that. Isn't that a 90-day clock on that? So when you say extend it as much as possible, how do you extend it after that? At least not without getting into any of the day one CPT, all of those buckets. Yeah, so there are ways that you can stop your clock as well. So if you volunteer work and all of that, majorly more volunteer work, that's what most of my classmates and my peers are doing at this point as well. They've signed up with an NGO in their area of study, which allows them to stay for a longer period than 90 days.

It's actually not that convoluted. I think it's pretty straightforward. That's true. Even you can even do a TA or an RA shift, right? I believe to stop that clock or is that all right? You can absolutely anything that's in your area of study, which stops your clock, will allow you to stay for a period longer than 90 days. So it's not really that difficult. So it wasn't really about the clock, which actually made me want to come back. It was more of, I just had a goal in my mind that I wanted to start working as soon as I possibly put by, I wanted to start, if nothing was working out, if there was no progress in the US by the month of August, I wanted to come back home, which is what I did. There were financial considerations too that I had to take into

consideration as well, staying in the US is pretty expensive, especially when you can't work. I was just going to say, yeah, you can't just indefinitely do an RA shift where you're barely getting paid and you're paying rent through the nose every month. So of course that's a consideration. So those are my considerations, but in case these are things that are not things that you have to consider in your situation, I would consider trying to look for a job in the US for as long as you possibly can. I'm sorry, what was the question again?

I completely, my question was, yeah, how are your peers going to be paying in the job month? So, so a total of 10 people graduated from my master's in marketing program. So we can do a program either in 10 months or 18 months, we had a class of about 36 students, out of which 10 graduated this past May. So I think about four or five of them have gotten jobs, most of them have gotten jobs in the past few weeks. It has been a long wait for them as well. There were only a couple of students who were a job back in June or July, I think. So they've had to be patient with their job search as well, but things are slowly getting better. I also know people from other programs who are slowly getting jobs as well. So I think the recent interest rate cuts that

the Fed announced has helped the job market and the fact that they've said that there are going to be more rate cuts in the future should consequently help the job market as well. So that's what I've been doing. I've been praying for all my peers back in the US so that they can get jobs and they can fulfill their purpose of having gone to the US because I know some people who genuinely went to the US with the sole objective of wanting to work there or settle down there at some point.

I think that's most people. Most people, most people, there a few people are in the same boat as me who actually decided to come back after finishing their graduation. So things are working out now. I think that's which is precisely why I said that as hard as the going gets, it's very important to just stay put and be patient because something or the other that does necessarily work out, especially if you've gone to a university which is very reputed. And even otherwise the job market, like I think it goes in cycles. What goes up comes down. What comes down is going to go back up at some point. So it's just a matter of patience just in my opinion. Absolutely. And I think it really speaks to your character where you mentioned that some of those peers got jobs

within the last month and that must have been after you came back and I'm sure I'm a hundred percent sure it must have crossed your mind that what if I would have stayed back? Maybe I would have also gotten a job. And despite all that, you know, you just seem so optimistic and positive about your own future. It's just really commendable to me to see that character shine through you. And you also said that you've been praying for your peers. So yeah, I mean, I know it's not easy.

So I really commend your ability to keep a cool head in all of this. And I know your reference when we sing earlier that you've also been looking for jobs in India. It sounds like you're interviewing. So yeah, I've no doubt that things will, you know, align in place for you as well. But yeah, just really wanted to share that before. My next question here, which is purely from a logistical sense, what are did you have a checklist of things you had to do before you moved back, be it in terms of closing any bank accounts. I don't know, maybe any credit cards, any investments that you had. What's like, what is that, what does the logistical side of the house look like when you are, you know, leaving a country for good? Absolutely. I'd be happy to walk you

through that. Yes, I had my, like you, like you correctly mentioned, I had my bank account that I had to close there. I had one with Chase. So I was in West Lafayette till the month of July. I think I left West Lafayette on the 25th of July after which I went to Boston for about about a week, week eight or 10 days. And then I finally went to New Jersey, which is where my relatives live. I stayed with them for the rest of my period there. So I, I closed my bank account with Chase in New Jersey. I had to get my, I also had my phone connection. I had a family plan with my client. With my cousin who lived in Texas. So he got the phone connection for me done.

So since he was the primary holder of the account, he was the one who had to get it done. So I posted it and have to do anything. I just, I just asked him to get my account close so that, you know, he wouldn't be charged for my account for the consequent month. I remember doing that on my final date because I already got my Indian number up and running on a couple of days before I left, a couple of days before I left for India. So it was again, it was a very emotional time because I'd use the last one here. I am using that. I mean, I, I'm someone who's very attached and emotional about these little things. So closing my bank account, closing, getting my phone number deactivated. These were things, these were things which actually accentuated and kind of cemented the

fact that I was indeed going in case I had forgotten, which I hadn't, but it kind of, then it's finally then that it dawns upon you that time is actually here. So these are a couple of things that I did. I remember from what I can remember logistically, I think it's the bank account and the phone number majorly that I was, I also made sure that I kept my social security numbers safely because, you know, you never know if things work out, I might go to the US again in the future. So those are just a few considerations that I had other than that. It was, I think that's about it when it comes to the logistics of things. Makes sense. And yeah, I guess for really, like just to speculate really or any other, like the other things that come to mind would probably be those similar veins. Like

you probably, if you have credit cards, you would probably want to make sure that they're all paid for deactivated, make sure there's no like, you know, identity theft going on, or at least leave the door open for that to happen. So yeah, that all makes sense. And then, so no, I don't know how I missed that. I think when I was talking about bank, I kind of, I didn't, I should have been a little more specific about what I did in the bank exactly. It's like, like you rightly said, deactivating your debit credit cards are very, very important. It's integral, again, identity identity theft is a really concerning issue all over the world. And you have to make sure that you get all of these things done. So deactivating my card was also on the, on the cards as well as

definitely yes. Cool. Yeah, absolutely. And then, so then looking inwards, so can you walk me through, you know, and I know this might, again, I hate to be putting this all on you because it must have been such an emotional roller coaster. But yeah, what were the first two weeks back like, like, you know, you're just back. So I'm sure you must have dealt with at least in some shape size or form, what's commonly referred to as a reverse culture shock. Maybe I don't know, I'm speculating you could tell me that didn't. So what was it like to, you know, reintegrate and I know it took time, you're probably still reintegrating. I don't know. But I'm very curious to hear the, you know, the mindset shift that happens. I'm assuming when you come back home, which is, you know, it's such a paradox to think about. Absolutely. I think

coming back home was, you know, it was a very bittersweet feeling. Like I said, right at the beginning of the video, I was very, very happy to be back home with family and friends people. So unlike a lot of my peers, I had not gone back home in the month of December. So this had actually been the longest that had been away from them because my entire educational journey before that had been in Mumbai itself. So this was actually the first time I was away from family. Given that that was the situation, I think I was, I still remember how happy I was when I met my family for the first time. My mom ordered a whole arty for me as well, when I got back home, I felt really sweet. My dad was very emotional as well. My sister was very happy to see me. My

eyes surprised a few friends as well, actually, who didn't know that I was coming back. I had to, I had to be a little careful about my return in that regard because I had to hide them from my stories and tell other people not to let them know. So I was a little skeptical about whether I could keep the surprise of what I thankfully was able to. And it really was a great experience in that sense. Or even when I was leaving, I was weighing down on me, there are a lot of things that are very ubiquitous in the US is not going to be available in India. Very small things, things that people might know might take for granted when they're in the US, for example, very simple things like people being extremely polite, people asking you to have a good day. These are small

things that may not make a lot of difference to people, but for me personally, I felt good every time I did that in the US. Again, that's not to say that it doesn't happen in India, but it's a lot more common in the US as compared to India. So that's one of the differences that I had to get used to. Another thing that I think this is not very, I mean, this is not very difficult to understand, but you know, the traffic management in the US and the infrastructure in the US is again something that you miss. The serene calm atmosphere in the US as compared to India is again something that I really miss. People are a little much more patient over there when it comes to driving. When you come back here, you hear a lot of people honing and you know, the infrastructure

is good, but there's a lot of scope for improvement. It starts flooding a little bit after rains as well. So these are a few things that I had to get used to. And then there are a few people who are making fun of me for that. They said that, you know, you've been living in, you lived in India for about 25 years of your life. You only in the US per year, but I just have to, I kind of disagreed with them and I told them that it's very difficult when you are so used to living in a certain way, like I was in India, and then you go to the US and then you have to unlearn all of those things that you learned in the US, learn a new way of living. And then to have to unlearn that, even if it was for only a year, a year seems like a, you know, it might not seem like a lot,

but for me personally, I think a year is a lot to integrate into another culture completely, even when I was here in the US for vacation, that one month I integrated pretty well into the culture, because I'm someone who likes discipline and someone who likes to follow the rules. So being in the US made me feel at home when it came to all of those things. So people made fun of me for that, but I think I spoke my cousin who had gone to Australia and then he also came back to India. He decided to come back to India and we were having a discussion and he was able to understand exactly where I was coming from. So I think people who haven't left the country are not able to really understand what you're going through. So it's always nice to have someone

who's been through the same thing to up to you as well. That's very interesting. Yeah, you referenced culture, although maybe culture is in the right word. Excuse me, you referenced, yeah, when you said that people are more polite. Yeah, maybe it's just like behavioral norms. Maybe you could file it under that. You mentioned infrastructure. Was there any other thing that you miss about the US? Maybe if we frame the question that way, you know, you meant, yeah, for instance, I know that India is just a very, it's a much more communal society than the US, which is much more individualistic.

So do you have any thoughts on maybe you had more independence in the US or is that not a fact? Oh, actually, yeah, that is an interesting point. The US is a lot more individualistic as compared to the compared to India, where people are a lot more involved in each other's lives. So yeah, it's kind of like a double-edged sword in some sense. It's good to have that independence, but sometimes it's good to have people who are checking up on you as well. So that is something I'm very, I kind of was able to transition from my time in the US to back to India pretty easily when it came to that. It was more of the infrastructural differences. And I think the thing that I was was about the US personally was the fact that, you know, I got to meet people from all over the world,

like, you know, something as simple as sitting in an Uber and you might have someone who was, you know, from from from Europe or from Africa or from South America. You know, you don't get that sort of thing in India. We have a lot of heterogeneity in terms of cultures in India. We have so many cultures and people following different faiths. But when it comes to nationality, India is a pretty homogeneous nature, especially as compared to... So most of the people who meet are Indians, but in the US actually got to explore and talk to people from all over the world, which I think broadened my horizon in ways that I never thought was even possible because I personally considered myself a very, um, someone who's very pro-globalization, someone who's very

liberal, but coming to the US made me realize that there's so much more hope for, you know, being open to other cultures as well. And it was a great experience. I think that's the, if the, if there's one thing that I missed the most about the US, I think it would be that. It would be the fact that, you know, it was genuinely a melting pot of culture of cultures. Interesting. Yeah. That totally attracts with me. Yeah. It's, there is really something about, you know, you could just throw a stone and it would probably land on somebody that is from a country that a lot of times, if you're me, you've never even heard of like, I met this person from Lithuania the other day while playing volleyball and I was like, where is that? And she was like, oh, that's fine. I get that a lot. But yeah, it's just funny what you said brought that to mind.

In terms of lifestyle differences, if you just think of, you know, a day in the life, a general day in the life that you were having in the US, maybe like, I know student life is a little bit different. So maybe you can think about your life when you were in Boston or when you were in New Jersey, maybe, and then contrast that to your day in the life, maybe yesterday. What are some of the, you know, most stark differences that come out in terms of like life? I think some of the things that you take for granted when you are here in South Asia is the fact that you are able to afford house help a lot more than you can in the US. That's one thing that I've spoken to a lot of people from India and the thing, one of the things that makes it, right, and the most difficult thing

for them to adjust when they go to the US is the fact that you have to do everything by yourself. Personally, it wasn't too much of a trouble for me. I was able to integrate into that pretty easily. But after having come back, I do see the positives of, you know, not having to do everything by yourself because you realize that you get so much of extra time that, you know, you actually spent doing all your household shows. I mean, there are other small things that you appreciate about India as well, the fact that, I mean, I'm talking more specifically Mumbai, which is where I'm from.

It's very, I mean, if you want to take a rickshoot, it's not, I mean, there are ways to travel without burning a hole in your pocket because moogos are expensive in the US. Maybe not for people who are earning in dollars, but for people who are converting students, for example, it's a lot you're going to be traveling around in India as compared to over the US. But again, the you on the flip side, the US has amazing. I mean, there is there's a lot of scope for improvement when it comes to their overall public transport, but in West Lafayette specifically, we had a pretty decent bus network, which I thought was good.

Boston also had its metro service, which is again good. But again, I do understand that these were these are exceptions and not the rules there because there are a lot of places in the US where it becomes difficult to travel without a car. So again, that is something you appreciate being back in India. The fact that we have public transport here, which is cheap. The fact that if you don't want to travel in public transport, there's always the option of taking a rickshaw, for example, that is something that I think that's one of the things that I miss the most in the US, the fact that I couldn't just take a rickshaw. And you know, if I had to go somewhere within about 10 minutes away, I would have to think twice in the US over here. I mean, in India,

it's pretty easy. I can just take a rickshaw and get there in 10 minutes. Otherwise in the US, I would have to walk on the race. So yeah, certain benefits of being here for sure as well. Makes sense. Yeah. And I think that can also be extrapolated to just all the benefits that come out of, you know, a society or a population that is just way more denser in one place than the other. So, you know, if there's just way more people than probably stuff like that, you know, you get a helping hand more often than not. One of the very common discourses I hear about this subject online, which is, you know, just the contrast and what it is to go back and such is, you know, the small, not small, actually, I'm being sarcastic matter of pollution.

Is that something that you're willing to comment on like, is it that, you know, do you feel the difference that much every single day or is that is something that goes away with time? Just in terms of having fresh air to breathe and all of that. Oh, that's an excellent point. It brought up. I did touch upon pollution a little bit, but I realized I didn't, I didn't deep dive into it. So air pollution, absolutely. The fact when you're in the US, there's a stark difference between the air pollution in the US as compared to Mumbai as compared to India, especially as a metropolitan city like Mumbai. It's a lot cleaner in the US, the skies. I mean, you can actually see the skies without, I do miss that. That's one of the things that I really miss a lot as well, being able to look up at the sky and having a

clear sky to look at. It is not the same in India comparatively, I would say. And of course, I did touch upon this a little bit earlier, the noise pollution. There, I mean, it's very difficult to find moments of peace and quiet in a metropolitan city like Mumbai. On the other hand, people in the US are a little more patient when it comes to their behavior on the road, not a lot of ponding or a lot of pond buzzing, which happens actually had a conversation with an good driver from the US above this as well. He had visited India. He had an incredible time, but he also noticed this difference between people's behavior driving in the US also driving in India.

So that was the first thing you told me as a matter of fact. So yes, absolutely. I do think that there is a stark difference between how things are in the US also in India. That's what I personally feel. The pollution levels are starkly different, something that I'm still kind of adjusting to in all honesty. Makes sense. Yeah, appreciate that honest review. Have you felt that people perceive you differently now that you've come back from the US? And I mean that both in terms of maybe your personal life, but also professional life. So I know you've been applying for work and you've been looking for jobs and interviewing. So what has that experience been like? And obviously, you'll be speculating because I don't think you've asked. And if you have asked directly,

that's amazing. But what can you tell us about perception of somebody that comes back after getting their degree from the US? Yeah, so this might be a slightly difficult bill to swallow, but I think it's very important that you brought this up. And for people who want to go back, and again, this is one of the principal reasons I ask people not to go back to their home country, but without getting some work experience, because the harsh truth is the harsh reality is when you come back to India, and especially if you're an entry, I'm someone who's looking for entry level roles at this point. If you're a fresher, your degree in the US, even if it's a degree as valuable as one in the in top university like poor, you at the entry level is not really going to be valued

as much in terms of when I say not valued, of course, they will appreciate the fact that you've been to the US and you know, you have a degree from one of the top universities in the world, but in terms of compensation, they're not really looking at you with the same, they're not looking to compensate you in the same bracket as say some of the top universities in India, like the IAMs or XLRI or even NMIMs, for example. So at the entry level, it's your you might you may not see the fruits of your labor of that amazing degree that you have from the US. It's only at a later point of time when you accumulate some work experience and then, you know, it's time for promotions and then people look at your resume and say, Oh, look, this guy is from Purdue University, then it makes

a difference and then you stand out. But in terms of your entry level positions, I think you're viewed pretty much the same as any other person. Oh, yes, they do ask you why you chose to come back to India and you know, I'm very dukly honest about it and all honesty. I do tell them, let them know that you know, I was looking for jobs in the US, but the job market wasn't too good and I always intended to come back. So I just decided to come back eventually. And they appreciate the honesty actually are of our interviewed at about five or six companies and pretty much all the interviewers were impressed and I did manage to progress to the next round. So I I think it would be safe to say that that wasn't a deal breaker for them. So yeah, that is one thing to keep in mind. So when you I also spoke to someone from from Pakistan and his cousin,

he did his masters and supply chain management from Michigan Ross, which is again a top top university. And yeah, yeah, again, he was looking for jobs in the US, but so in Pakistan and unfortunately, it's the same same story there. They did not really in South Asia, they're not really acknowledging the fact that you have, but you know, have a degree from one of the top universities in the world in terms of your compensation at the entry level at a future point of time from what I've heard from experts in the industry, they do say that it makes a huge difference and you're really going to have a huge salary bump at some point in the future. But if you're thinking that, you know, you want to pull you and then you're going to come back to India and then be paid

the same way and I am and the bad grad would be that I just have to boast that bubble and say that there's a there's a stark difference. You're not really going to be looked at at the same lens as someone from I am and the one. In fact, you're not even going to be looked at with the same lens as someone from a tier below that of top college, but maybe not the absolute cream of the cream like an amiabas. So that's something you have to come to terms with and something to take into consideration before you decide to go back, especially if you're from South Asia. That is so interesting.

I would not have assumed that. I was in the impression that, you know, now that I have a degree from Purdue, I should be able to get the kind of salary that, you know, people from top universities in India would get, unfortunately, at the entry level, it's not like that. I've spoken to a few other people as well. It's not just been my story. Like I said, my friend whose brother did his Masters from Michigan draws. And then there are a few other people, a lot of people from the UK unfortunately who had to come back from top universities in the UK. And once again, they've not been able to get jobs which are able to complement the kind of skills that they bring to the table, unfortunately. I think, I mean, now that I've had, you know, two minutes to think about this,

and obviously I'm just speculating, I have no way of knowing for sure why this is. But I think probably this could be because of, it's just simple supply demand, right? Like, if the current market, which I know isn't even the best in India either at this point, if you have the pool of these, as you said, like these NMIMS grads that have, you know, shown and demonstrated qualities that they're looking for versus somebody that's coming from an abroad university. I think it's just a simple option for the employees. It shouldn't be, excuse me, but I can see where, I can see where they're coming from, probably. Do you think that would be toward? I think so, because if you've been, like if you go through the news in India, job market here is also not at its best, not as bad as it is in the US, but people even from

IITs are not getting jobs for those who may not be from my, from India, IITs are basically the MIT of India. So even people from IITs are not getting jobs, people are struggling to get jobs even from the IITs. And those who are getting jobs are getting packages, which are a lot lesser than what people usually expect, right, coming right out of IIT. I have a friend who's doing his MBA from, I am Lucknow as well. You know, my God's grace, he's gotten an internship and I'm exceptionally happy for him. But there are others who have not, it's, I think like you said, it's a supply demand problem. There are not enough jobs that are being, that are available out there because of the job market and because just, you know, jobs have not been created as much as we would

like. So that is what I think is the issue at this point of time. So it's not just people from abroad, that is definitely people who are from abroad are definitely going through the brand of all of that. But even people from top universities in India are finding it difficult right now. So of course, companies like you said are more comfortable placing students who are from top universities in India. So they are usually given preference for someone who's come from a abroad in my opinion. No, that makes sense. And because you've had, you know, you've had the unique experience of getting business degrees, you could argue that marketing isn't a business degree, but we'll just say this for, you know, just for this little, you know, question, just humor me.

So between me and you, leave aside any employed, leave aside any industry, which do you think objectively was more valuable for you as a, you know, for your professional career? Was it your MBA or the masters that you got at Purdue? Oh, if I'm being absolutely honest, both degrees had their merits. I don't want to be politically correct, but it's genuinely how it was. But if I had to choose between the two, I think the degree at Purdue was really, I think it's my, it's my biggest achievement academically and always will be for the rest of my life. The fact that you get to share a classroom with people from all over the world means that you actually get new perspectives on how to solve a business problem, which I think is invaluable, especially in an increasingly globalized world. Today we are working in globalized teams. The world

is getting smaller as they say. So I think getting that experience has helped me quite a bit and, you know, I personally think that it will help me a lot in my career as well. So that is one consideration to make. I think the other considerations to make is just the way Indian MBAs are also changing. They're kind of adopting what the masters in the U.S. are looking like because my MBA and the U.S. and India had a lot of case studies, which is something that Howard started. Initially, it was just the IAMs of which were doing it. But now even the other business schools have started doing it, which is great. I think being able to inculcate good habits from foreign universities is going to, you know, give us, make our education system better, which is what everyone is looking

at at this point. So if I had to choose between the two, I would say I prefer my degree. I mean, I wouldn't say preferred, preferred will be the right term. I just, well, yeah, I get it. Yeah, you were. It's interesting though, because you, if you made it sound like there wasn't that big of a gap between the two. So that's what's interesting to me. And that's what caught my eye. You know, I would have probably assumed that the gap would be much more pronounced there. So that's very interesting. I think the major gap, because I can talk about, like I can talk about my experience from about my friend who's doing his MBA from IAM, Lucknow as well, is that Indian MBAs versus doing her masters in the US. It's very, but also I had a professor who had, I had a couple of classmates

who had done MBAs from top colleges in India. One was, one did it, one did her MBA from IAM Calcutta, the other one did it from ISB. And one of our professors in the elite schools. Absolutely elite schools. Yeah. And I had my professor who actually was, who had done his MBA from IAM and the father's as well. So I recall over during a conversation between the professor and the student who had gone to IAM Calcutta and he was talking about how academically Indian MBAs are a lot more demanding, lot more rigorous compared to your universities in the US. So universities in the US may not be as demanding academically, but they do require you to, they do test you in a lot of other ways, because you know, you're away from home, you have to adjust to a new culture. There are a lot of

extracurricular activities that are going on as well. There are extracurricular activities in India as well, but there are a lot more encouraged in the US because they're looking for more of a holistic development versus India in my opinion. So in India, the rigor is a lot more aligned to academic achievements. Whereas in the US, there are academic, the rigor is obviously there for academic programs as well, especially for a business program, business analytics and information management for business students, otherwise known as BAME. I remember those guys had, those guys, their rigor could actually be compared to the rigor of Indian MBAs students.

That's true. That's so true. Yeah. I've had a few friends from there as well. Yep. They're crazy. They just, they go hard, man. Yeah. And they're able to do part-time jobs and they're able to be, and they're able to take part in extracurricular activities as well, which I think just sets them apart. I think like the level of respect I have from before BAME students just generally produce students that are some of the smartest people I've met in my life. And that's saying a lot because I know a lot of smart people, like we've discussed, people from I Am Lucknow, people who are CAAs, CFAs. And yet the kind of discussions that I've had with poor students, it's absolutely blew my mind. And if you were to really objectively assess, you know, just to contrast and to just go further in this, you know, MBA in India versus

Masters in US discussion that I don't even know how we got into. If you remove the extracurriculars that you mentioned and all of the part-time jobs and such, because one could argue that that's not really what you're there for. Those are, you know, like the side quests that you do for 100% experience. I'm all for that. Everybody should do that. But I'm just saying if you were to just look at the academics, it's it does sound like both you and I have probably aligned on that.

It is way more rigorous in India versus the US. And that's just interesting because it's not something that's super obvious from the outside. So that's the reason why I'm calling that out. I don't know if you would agree. It sounded like that's what you were saying that absolute academic part is separate. But when you add in all of that extra stuff, sure, 100% that makes it way harder because probably your friend from Amlakno isn't having to, you know, do his laundry every day. Maybe he does. I don't know. But it's just different. Like here, at least in India, he can go out and not be like an outsider, which is something that you face here. When he's applying for jobs, he's not automatically, you know, not applicable for one, you know, nine out of 10 jobs,

maybe. So all of that is very much true. But yeah, if you just focus on the academics, I think it is interesting that, you know, it's way more rigorous in India than outside. And yeah, that's not something that's super obvious. So I know we've covered a lot here. And just, you know, the last question here, before I let you go, do you ever feel like an outsider in India now that you've come back just, you know, in terms of the, you know, people around you?

Oh, that's, that's actually a very interesting question. There are times where I do feel like people don't really understand where I'm coming from. Because when I, you know, I'm, I'm someone who's very, um, attached and my country is something which is very close to my heart. My, my grandfather, my maternal grandfather was an army officer as well. So I'm someone who has a lot of love for his nation. But having said that, I also, um, I'm able to appreciate the time that I had in the U.S.

I do believe that if you truly love someone, I think there's a difference between loving something and loving the idea of something. So when you truly love something, which is the case with me in India, you're always looking for ways to make it better. When you're in love with the idea of something, you just love it for what it is. And you think that there's nothing new other country on this planet which can do what India can do, which is fine. I am not saying that there's an issue with that. But I just personally think that there's always going for improvement. So when I talk about my experience in the U.S., for example, the goods, um, infrastructure, the fact that people are a lot more disciplined over there, people in India are not really able to relate to that too

much. Because if you've never been abroad, you, um, you're not able to value, you're not able to truly appreciate these things. But since I spent a year abroad, I have been able to do that. So I think, uh, moments like those when I'm making a direct comparison between something in the U.S. versus something in India, something as, um, you know, something like the employment laws as well. For example, if I had to get a little more, um, if I had to talk about something a little more detailed employment laws, I had ought stricter in the U.S. versus here in India. So these are things that, uh, if you've been working in an, in an Indian corporate all your life, that's not something which is going to, uh, you know, it's not going to strike your mind. Move the needle for you. Yeah.

Yeah. Because I had someone who had, um, someone from one of my classmates from Purdue who was, um, doing an, uh, master, uh, who's doing an internship and her boss was Indian. So surprisingly, she thought that, you know, the fact that her boss would, is Indian would actually help her, but it actually hindered her from, um, you know, in terms of how she wanted to go about doing things, because she was too Americanized in terms of how she went about studying and meant about doing a work that there was a cultural clash when it came to her and her manager, even though they were from the same, uh, they're from the same country. So yeah, I do feel like outside of times, but for the most part, I would say that, uh, this is home. So, you know, you, um, you do, when you see familiar faces,

you kind of, uh, you know, you, you are grateful for what you have. And I, that's, that's how I feel at the moment as well. I do miss the US a lot. Um, and, uh, there are always going to be things that, uh, I, you know, remember very fondly and I'm always going to be looking forward to the times that I go to the US again. But, um, I am happy to be in India. It is home after all. And, um, I think that, or it takes a little bit of time. Uh, few people have been a few friends have been questioning me about why I'm a little quieter than usual. And I think it's just gotten to do with the fact that I'm just trying to adjust to life here back in India, given that I was in the US for so long. And I think it's just a matter of time. Time is going to heal everything. And again,

that's not to say that I'm not happy here in India. I am. I'm incredibly happy. It's just that it's a little bit of an adjustment to make in all honesty. Are you bullish or bearish on the India growth story and why? Oh, so that's a, that's a difficult question actually. And I've been doing a lot of reading about this as well. And I do believe that, um, you know, given the, we've touched upon a few things which makes India a huge market for, um, you know, the future, especially given the fact that our, we have a huge population 1.2 billion people. That is a lot of people. And, you know, the market penetration for most products like cars, uh, like air conditioners, like televisions, we've, you know, we've barely scratched the surface when it comes to these sectors. So there's so much

of growth, so much of scope for growth there because, you know, we have one of the youngest, biggest youngest population in the world. So I do believe with the right policies, frameworks, we could really, um, like the next 10, 20 years are going to be instrumental for a country like India. So a lot of people have told me that my decision to come back to India is actually a great one, even if you want to talk about it objectively, because given the fact that they feel personally that, you know, the, the US is a saturated market versus India, which is really going to expect it to grow exponentially. I'm personally of, um, am of the opinion that, um, it's not an automatic process that's going to be, it's going to take some good policy work and, you know, a lot of, um, careful management to ensure that India can reach the level that,

you know, we all aspire to be because, um, again, like we said, there are issues here in India as well. The fact that, you know, there are, there is a mismatch when it comes to demand and supply in the job market. So there are things to work on, but I do, I am, I am bullish on the, on, on a whole, I think, um, I am bullish about the Indian market. I think that good things are set to come in the future in the next few years. Amazing. Um, yeah, I guess just to, you know, tie the loop, maybe I should have led with this, but as somebody that's still undecided on what I'm going to do with this whole, you know, US versus India, you know, debate or where I'm going to end up. Um, you've given me incredible, just incredible perspectives here today about, you know, what goes into making that decision or what should go into making that decision and

what to expect either side of the coin, whichever way the wind blows. And I would really like to thank you for that. And I do also think that anybody that's listening to this will be for sure, drawing such amazing insights from what you've shared about, you know, just a real, really the nuances that you just shared about, you know, how you feel versus, um, you know, actually doing things to reintegrate. It's, yeah, it's just a whole lot. And I commend your resilience and, uh, yeah, really. Thank you for taking the time today. And for our listeners, um, that thick has a really nice YouTube channel. It's called resilient ratty. So I would, I'm a subscriber. I really enjoy watching you and your content. And I would love to encourage anybody and everybody listening to go check it out. And if you'd like, uh, you know,

subscribe to his channel as well. Is there anything else that you would like to say here before we close out? Oh, again, I think thank you so much for that. It really means a lot because your channel is honestly an inspiration for mind. The fact that, you know, um, the fact that we're both boilermakers, we're both people who just started off the channel, but the level of professionalism that your videos have in terms of editing in terms of the way you speak in terms of your company. It feels like you are someone with, you know, who's been doing this for years. And I say this in the best possible way. So I'm always really looking forward to what you're doing in your channel. Um, one of your, I, one of the, one of the videos that I was particularly very,

very hooked to is the video that you made up with someone who just recently published a book, because that's something I'm looking to do as well in the future. So I think what you're doing is great service to society. And thank you so much for that. Uh, you really are, I think you're the next big thing when it comes to YouTube, uh, you've heard it here first. So, you know, um, for anyone who's for everyone who's watching and know that, you know, this is the channel to be, this is the place to be. Uh, and when it comes to what I have to say, I think I'm just going to reiterate what I said earlier, because, um, you know, I think it's critical imperative for you to be patient to remember, uh, the duty, remember to work diligently on your duties and not focus on

the result. And so as long as you can try getting that job in the US, because, um, objectively, it's going to help you a lot. Even when you come back to your home country, having that experience is going to set you apart, uh, from other people who will not have that experience, that sort of experience. And even, um, culturally, I think it's very important to be able to understand, uh, it's, it's, it's a good idea that if you've studied in a country, you also understand the nuances of how things work and their corporate setup as well. And, uh, overall, I just think that the best use of your degree would be if you were to be able to get some sort of work experience, now, unless you have some other considerations that, um, cut other constraints, of course,

um, like I did. So I decided to come back, but if I had the, if I had the opportunity, I would definitely work for, even if I wanted to come back, even if I was really homesick, this is something my uncle and my best friend told me. It's just a matter of, you know, if you've been able to, if you've been able to pass the tide for a year, another year or two is not going to hurt, because you can always go back home for sure that that weeks back at home, you know, meet everyone. And then I think it really is going to do amazing things for your career to have that, or have that work X in your resume. So once again, that's my final tip for all of you guys. Just, um, you know, hang in there. I understand that it can be frustrating at times, uh, especially when

you're, you know, you hear other people talk about it all the time. And you know, that's something I, when I was in the US, I never liked talking about my job search with other people. I just kind of wanted to do my own thing and talk about other things. I don't really hear everyone talking about that when you open LinkedIn, when you see, you know, your classmates who are getting jobs and you're obviously incredibly happy for them, but then it kind of makes you wonder where, you know, where it kind of makes you wonder where you are at the moment. So do not let all of that get to you, just, you know, just be patient and focus on the duty and not the result. That's all I can say at this point. Amazing. Thanks so much, Ratic. I wish you all the very best.

Thank you, Naman. Thank you. Mishing you the same. Thank you for having me on this channel. That brings us to the end of episode 34 of the ready set to podcast. Thank you all for sharing these episodes with those that continue to benefit from them. If you would like to support me the easiest way to do that is by subscribing to the YouTube channel, leaving me up to a five star rating on Spotify and any other podcast app of your choice. And also checking out the links in description and seeing if you can support me by buying me a coffee or any other resources. Catch you all in the next one new episodes every Wednesday.